Interesting Randall

I recently acquired this Randall with a rough back sheath. Of interest, at first glance it appears to be a modified 14, but it is definitely not.

Uuhhhhh...it most definitely IS...

Sorry when matched to a 14 it is not possible...but believe what you want...

GRI, please explain your observations. Welcome to the forum.

I too...find THAT response quite AMUSING!!!!!!

So what are we looking at then if it is not a 14?

GRI, this most definitely started out as a Model 14, however; someone altered the hilt and handle shape...AND put it in a wrong sheath...just my observations...

Looks like the blade may have been made narrower too.

Regards,
Doug

First, let me say that I did not plan on being attacked on my first posting. Second, I would have no problem if it was modified, it is a neat knife. A combat blade with a dive handle. Last, a physical comparison (side by side) shows it could not have been made from a 14. This said, I will concede that the 14 I have and used for a physical comparison is from the 1990’s.

So GRI, just remember that you came into a forum that includes many Randall experts, including Scott, that works in the Randall shop, and has seen it all, before and after. Hope you appreciate the expertise to help you with your questions, and expand your knowledge.

Pap

Heavily modified 14 in a model 1 sheath?

GRI, I meant no harm to you when I first stated that the knife was "definitely" a 14...I was using your description for clarification. I apologize for sounding as if it was an attack, please forgive me...

And Welcome to the forums, there is a wealth of knowledge here waiting to expunge...

Scott, you are a true southern gentleman.

Well just a dog-gone minute there Buddy.. No need for attacking me now!! Us Bostonians are thin-skinned u know?!?

I would like to see the comparison pics with a Model 14...

Definitely a 14 with a cut down guard and modified handle. And a relatively late Johnson Mod. 1 sheath.
Welcome to the forum.

can someone repost the photo? I can't get it to show

here you go

You are indeed a gentleman Scott, especially for apologizing when you were not at fault. It was that cocky "believe what you want" comment that was the problem in my opinion. I hate to disparage anyone on the forum, especially a new person, but I think that was a bad way to get started on here. I have definitely learned here that it's always best to be cautious and open minded about what you "think" you know about RMK's.

I believe Scott is a gentleman. Well done.

I would like to see a photo of it next to the 14 you compared it to.

Not all 14s are identical.

Thanks to everyone helping with my knife. Here are comparison photos. The handle hight is the same on both the 14 and this knife. The width of the 14 is an 1/8” more. The notable difference on this knife is the distance from the back of the knife to the first finger groove which is an 1/8” longer and and is apparent to the naked eye. They could not add material and assuming all 14’s are made to specs, the knife could not come from a 14.

While looking at the knives, I do not believe it would be possible to eliminate completely the finger grooves, though this knife is 1/8” thinner.

Looks like a modified #14 to me.

As others have said, welcome to the Forum GRI!!
If you continue to hang around here I'd be willing to bet this will become by far your most favorite social media to land on. At least that happened for me for over a couple decades now (how can that be?!). Of course, come to think of it, it is the only one I've ever joined. Or looked at. But who cares?
AND DW does at times come across like a know it all about Randall Made Knives, BUT, ya' gotta' remember he is a Bostonian; and that in fact re: Randalls that he does indeed know it all.
Which kinda' explains why he can get kinda' riled about being called a "southern gentleman" but you can say whatcha' want all day long 'bout his mama & all you'll hear is "So!" (I think this is a clever retort in Boston). Also explains (kinda') why he predicts that the Red Sox will win the World Series every year....in every sport. If you, or anyone, challenges him on this you will soon learn that he also will use the same clever retort here.
If you do decide to hang out here, and especially if you do actively contribute, comment, post pics., etc. I'll bet you'll learn a lot, & love this site & the other guys (& gal) on it. AND, like Jim, you'll learn it's really pretty easy to get along & "best not to disparage anyone". Except maybe Warren.......or Ronnie.....or Crutchtip.
Because they don't care & they can take anything.
And as our good Captain (Oh man, watch out there!!) says.....
"Best to 'ya & I hope this is helpful",

It is possible that it was not originally a finger grip 14. Often the finger grips are deeper on some knives and more shallow on others. It could have been a single finger grip or Border Patrol handle also.
It is an interesting knife and looks like owner modified to me

Welcome to the forums

Peter

Here is a 15 that has been modified, this one the blade, as in reground.

Well said Duke!

Yes, welcome (should have said that in my first post, sorry). Interesting knife. Given that Scott would definitely know if an RMK was made or modified at the shop (even as a one-off which do exist), I think we have to rule that out. So that would mean an owner modification. As for the differences with the "standard" 14, I've been told time and time again here that Randalls are hand made so individual knives can vary within the same model type. That's the best I can come up with here but then I am not anywhere close to having the expertise others on here have. Thanks for bringing this up.

There really are no "specs" as the wrist thongs are all done by "eye"...

Scott, you are a true northern born gentleman.

Scott just beat me to the “spec” issue. There have been many different craftsmen building these knives at the shop thru the years. Each does his thing and although they come out close they are all a little different.

GRI, what is sort of being said here is......

All RMK's are handmade without jigs or fixtures. To say that a difference of 1/8" is a determining factor is not viable.

Depending on when and who, there is variation. RMK'S remain handmade.

AND THAT'S why we call you Tom the Bomb!!

The steel itself is 1/8" thinner or the handle+hilt?

If it's the steel, then you have an interesting piece.

If it's the handle+hilt being thinner, that's more possible evidence of "has been ground post-shop."

Pretty sure he is talking about the width of the blade top to bottom. A .125 thick blade would be pretty thin for a fighting, utility, camp knife.

Just for giggles and grins I miked 5 Model 14s and found that the thickness 1" from the hilt ranged from .2251 to .2111, a difference of only .014. The thickness just before the start of the top bevel ranged from .2256 to .2047. That consistency is just remarkable given that the blades are all hand forged, ground, and polished by eye!

I also measured the distance from the butt end of the handle to the closest edge of the ferrule and the distance from the top of the handle to the top edge of the ferrule. The distances from the butt end to the ferrule varied from 27/64" to 21/64" a variation of 3/32" just 1/32" short of 1/8". The distance from the top of the handle to the top of the ferrule varied from 7/16"-19/64". Just as DW said, no jigs, no specs, the craftsman puts the hole where he thinks it should go.

GRI-Let me add my welcome to you. This is a great place to talk and learn about RMKs, to make new friends, and to meet some very interesting characters. As others have said, when DW talks Randalls, we all listen. HOWEVER, when DW talks baseball, that's a whole different thing. He's a Red Sox fan, need I say more? Anyway, welcome aboard.

Regards,
Doug

I know it's been mentioned here that Scott (Dirty Water) works at the shop, and that alone lends enough veracity to anything he says about Randall Made Knives, but it gets a little better. You see, Sott is actually the Shop Foreman, overseeing production of every aspect of knife making in that shop on a daily basis. There's just no-one here that brings roughly 30 years of day to day expertise like he does, his authority is beyond reproach, and in spite of that he remains humble and is quick and willing to share his insights. He, along with some very seasoned collectors and RMK dealers make this the go-to forum for a wealth of information that's unrivaled anywhere else. If you wanna learn Randall's, this IS the place. I hope you hang around and enjoy!

Awww, Wally. You spilled the beans!

You're right Rob, we could let that one play out a little further!